Pedini - integra in grey oak.This blog was created in order to put together as much information as possible about European kitchen design, European kitchen companies and the different kitchen brands that have been manufacturing custom kitchens and built in kitchens, in Europe for more then a century.
European kitchen designers are the first ones to introduce what we know today as the ‘built in kitchen’ – kitchens that are no longer ‘free-standing’ pieces of furniture (as they were 100 years ago) but kitchens that are designed to have the cabinetry fitting between two walls.
Companies like Snaidero, Boffi, Pedini, Dada, Varenna and Val Cucine, from Italy, Poggenpohl, SieMatic, Allmilmo and Bulthaup , from Germany and Smallbone and Clive Christian, from England are the pioneers, the innovators and the companies that set the tone in Europe – the same tone that then becomes the new look for kitchen design around the world.
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Hi Kitchen Guy
I am looking to replace my kitchen and am keen on a german kitchen. I like Hacker but the carcasses are 16mm and 3mm backs for the walls, Are these sufficient as I am told by many other suppliers to have 18mm backs for both base and walls.
Heh! The designs from the companies you mentioned especially Pedini & Bulthaup are some of the best I’ve ever seen. It would be a dream come true to keep some of these designs for my kitchen.
Great Blog! We are deciding between an Eggersmann and Poliform (Varenna). Appearance wise, they are close, Eggersmann is more expensive. In your opinion, it the price differential/ value worth it for Eggersmann, and if so, why? Thanks
John – if the finishes are the same and all else is ‘apple to apple’ I think that you can comfortably go with Varenna.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
I am from Jordan and we are deciding between boffi, eggersmann and Varena. Would you say that boffi is the highest end? And should the price of varena and eggersmann be comparable? Please rate them for me in terms of price and quality. It is so difficult to determine if we are getting the fair price for the product here because of the way the market is. Boffi is very new to Jordan and so are the other two. The suppliers of boffi and Varena are also new to high end kitchens. Please advise.
Dalia – Yes, Boffi is the better one. Regarding the rest of your questions, I am in no position to answer them, as I am not familiar with the Jordanian market…
kitchenguy
Does anyone have a list of European appliance brands that are showing off-site from Eurocucina 2012? the FTK Exhibit only has about 20 or so brands, but I know there are others that don’t exhibit on-site, and choose an off-site location. Any help is appreciated!
hi
l seek your advice.
looking at siematic s1, poggenpohl, and b3 bulthaup.
pricewise, siematic is coming out cheapest with bulthaup in the middle, and poggenpohl most expensive.
2x double slide out units 80cm wide each under the cooking plate.
3 units (1dishwasher, 1 sink, and one small slide out unit)
and one just for storage. above all of these a composite top.
3 high closets (1 for fridge, 1 for oven, microwave, and 1 for feezer and storage) with storge above each.
one hanging storage unit.
these are ranging from 7k euro to 11k euros. (ex the composite top)
should i be seeing this price difference? what is the better value for money? i.e what would you choose?
i have read a comment that you feel siematic is better than poggenpohl…in what areas do you see this? poggenpohl hinges feltl sturdier than siemetic.
the poggenpohl dealer told me to be carefulwith siematics due to its precarious financial standing but you mention poggenpohl may be in for hard times…can you elaborate on this and should this impact my decision / ability to fet better deal?
my wife is on me to make a decision so appreciate you feedback.
thx
Miguel – these are all great questions, but in order to answer them intelligently, I need more information… – your geographical location, the various dealers you have visited (are they a single or a multi-brand retailers), are they all pricing the same design/finish/interiors.
Being that you are under pressure and that it is very difficult for me, to be so specific, without studying your kitchen and the other variables, here is my advise – GO WITH YOUR HEART! Which kitchen you and your wife like better? Which designer/retailer have better references? Who do you guys have better “chemistry” with? – that’s the way to decide. All 3 brands are good and are at the top of their game and I doubt any of them are going out of business soon.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
thanks for the quick answer…
and by the way, an amazing site…wished i had found you earlier so i could have checked out some of the italian brands before making decision.
my heart says bulthaup. why?
trust the guy more. he has been the most open/transparent the whole process. only drawback is that he is 20% more expensive (4.5k euros more).
all other factors are similar…very similar design/layout, same material, same colors, same finishings, similar counter top, all handle-less, same appliances.
so my only other criteria is quality. and by quality i mean more the sturdiness/durability of the hinges of the drawers, doors, etc after thousands of openings/closings. my concern is that i see siematic (perhaps incorrectly) as a VW and the other two more of a BMW. more expensive but more durable.
and yes, i would spend the extra cash on a bmw but due to size of kitchen (not very big) the design element and position of kitchen as a centerpiece of the house is very limited (to put in kindly). so shame to spend the extra cash for limited wow effect as the “performance” of the kitchen will be the same in either (all miele equipment). and this is why my “brain” points at siematic. i guess i am testing my VW=siematic vs BMW=bulthaup hypothesis before i make my choice.
in case others are also reading my posting, what are your experiences with siematic kitchens five years on? do you have any regrets after buying siematic?
last question…with a small boy (1 year old), i have been recommended to go with laminate instead of lacquer. does this make sense? and should a child in the house influence choice of glossy or matte finish?
thanks.
kitchen guy…in case you are able to provide more insight, here are answers to your questions.
live in amsterdam, the netherlands.
going to:
a dealer that works exclusively with bulthaup
a dealer that works exclusively with siematic but also carries its own brand
a dealer that has its own brand (most of its sales) and sells also poggenpohl
all the same design/layout
similar material/finishings
same appliances
Miguel – Thanks again for the kind words.
I’ll have to disagree with you auto comparison – in my mind it is BMW=Poggenpohl, MBZ=SieMatic and Porsche=Bulthaup. This is taking in consideration quality, price and product selection/offerings.
The laminate IS stronger than the lacquer finish.
Good luck, again.
kitchenguy
This is spot on. Siematic calls themselves the Mercedes-Benz of kitchens (i worked at Siematic Loehne, Germany)
Why aren’t you naming Leicht as one of the top German brands?
Based on market share it’s the number one brand in Germany.
If you want I’ll send you the latest data from 2011.
Mayan – I simply feel that they do not belong in the Top 20 European brands… – my criteria’s were very specific and Leicht simply did not score high enough to be included…
I get all the European reports and not sure what you mean by “Based on market share it’s the number one brand in Germany” – please explain.
kitchenguy
VW has the largest market share in Germany.
That does not make it a luxury brand like BMW or Mercedes.
Hi, Do you have a email address i can contact you on? Regarding trade advertising. Thanks 🙂
Contacting you now.
kitchenguy
Was just at the new store opening for Poggenpohl in Milan last night. Guess this is why they pulled out of the fair this year?
Am in Milan for two more days… Any hot tips,on what else to see and do?
Kim – how did you like the new showroom?
Go to Zona Tortona – it’s lots of fun and lots to see.
kitchenguy
Have just purchased a condo in florida which includes an Aran kitchen. There isn’t a local showroom and I am concerned about the quality? It is a second home but I would like a high gloss lacquer finish which I want to look high end. Can you please give me some input. Also, do you know of an Aran showroom – perhaps in NYC?
Jan – Aran is a ‘price driven’ product, so you are correct, regarding the quality. Not sure if there’s a dealer in FL. but the one in NY, is located in Brooklyn.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
HI,
Could you please compare FGV and Samet to Grass Hettich and Blum
jay – the quality is almost the same, but the selection and options are much less.
kitchenguy
Hi KG
We are about to embark on a kitchen extension and want a white handleless kitchen(mid price range).
So far I have looked at Alno, Schuller, Nobilla and Pronorm German kitchens. Which ones would you recommend and why!?
Look forward to your response.
Regards Lou
Lou – all 4 are ‘price driven’ and more or less similar. My personal preference would be Schüller.
Good luck!
kitchenguy
Thanks for the info. Someone has now mentioned a Italian kitchen by Bontempi, what do you think of them? As good as the others above for the handleless kitchens?
Lou
Hi Lou – it is on par with the other brands you’ve mentioned.
Where in the world are you at? Perhaps I can make some suggestions.
kitchenguy
Which kitchen manufacturer has better quality kitchen – Hacker of Germany or Scavolini of Italy. Price is not an issue, only looking at quality
Shah – this is an easy one… – Häcker, hands down.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Where would you rank the American company henrybuilt among your European manufacturers?
Hi Stan – being that Henry Built is so different than “my European manufacturers”, it is not possible to compare -Henry Built is a small custom shop (and they are all factories) and much more expensive than they are (apple to apple).
kitchenguy
Hi, we are considering between Hacker or RotPunkt – any advice greatly appreciated. Seems Hacker is good, but not aware of RotPunkt and the kitchen designer pushing the latter. How do they compare in terms of price and quality?
Thanks
Mona – Häcker would be my choice. Rotpunkt is a fine product, a much smaller company but I think they are not at the same level. The question you should ask yourself is: “why is the designer ‘pushing’ one product over another…?!?” Perhaps it will be advisable to check out another designer…?
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Thanks Kitchenguy – appreciate your input.
You’re very welcome, Mona.
Dear KitchenGuy
Can you please compare ERNESTOMEDA ONE with ARAN MODEL VOLARE and ARREDO TIME?
Christiana – Ernestomeda is a much better product than Aran. Arredo Time is a small shop, if i’m not mistaken…
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Thank you
How about ArcLinea?
Hi again – Arclinea is much more in line with Ernestomeda than Aran.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Dear KitchenGuy,
Can you please compare Ernestomeda with Eggersman and Poggenbohl?
I am in love with an Ermestomeda One80 kitchen. Are Eggersman and Poggenbohl considered higher end kitchens than Ernestomeda? Is Ernestomeda considered lower quality?
Thanks!
Almost decided for Varenna Twelve, but now I am considering Doimo. Looks like good value for money, and we are having pretty big kitchen composition…
I would appreciate the advice. Thank you.
Sani – interesting how you picked two brands that are mainly furniture suppliers (Varenna, being Poliform’s kitchen brand and Doimo’s which is mainly a furniture company)… In terms of quality, I think they are similar, with Varenna having a slight edge.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Thanks for the opinion. Looks like the offer for Varenna is around 40k Eur with Miele machines. Seems too much. I can cut high gloss mediapan to matte version, and change Miele for Bosch/Siemens and save 10 k, but seems to me as a different kitchen than.
Other possibility is to take Doimo Sydney with high gloss mediapan, and Mele machines and to save same amount.
What do you think is better?
Snaidero Orange also could go.
Thanks
Sani – if you like them both the same, it’s an easy decision – go with Doimo.
Snaidero prices should be in line with Varenna’s.
Good luck!
kitchenguy
Hi kitchen Guy
Which is better snaidero or pronorm? Looking at handless lacquer kitchen for extension . Any help and comments appreciated. Am living in Ireland.
Pauline
Pauline – Snaidero is better.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Hello – I was wondering what you think of Euromobil ? quality/price ? How do they compare with Leicht ? Also, in this same price bracket, which other brand do you recommend. We live in south west London.
Thanks in advance
Sabine – Euromobile is a good brand, similar in price and quality to Leicht. You have many of the Top 20 brands right in your area – check some of them out.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Hi
I was quoted a very good price for a Schroder kitchen in laminate high gloss handleless. I cannot find any reviews on Schroder for quality etc – what is your opinion of them? Also I note they use 18mm with 3mm backs ?? I am also looking at Hacker but they are more expensive . Thanks
Debbie – Schröder Kitchens is a smaller manufacturer, available only in parts of Europe, offering a few unique, rustic looks as well as modern designs. They are more custom than the ‘big boys’ and the quality is decent, but this is not a high-end product… Häcker is a step above and therefore more expensive – you get what you pay for…
Good luck!
kitchenguy
thanks for the advise much appreciated. would it be possible to email you directly as have some more questions?
thanks
debbie
You’re very welcome, Debbie.
You can always contact me directly, via the Contact Us tab.
kitchenguy
Hi there,
Would you recommend hacker or beckermann and what are the differences between the classic and systemt range by hacker. Many thanks
Mamta – Häcker is better. Classic is their ‘value line’ – less options, better price. Systemat is the next level up.
kitchenguy
Wow thanks so much kitchenguy. So do you think there are quality issues with the classic range?what about Alno as opposed to hacker?
Mamata – no, it has nothing to do with quality, just with the number of options and the ability to customize. Alno is a step down.
kitchenguy
Thank you so much, fab website, so pleased I stumbled across it. Thanks again
Thanks for visiting our site!
kitchenguy
Hi Kitcheguy,
My question was similar to Mamta’s question. Were deciding between handless Alno Smartline and Hacker Classic (based in the UK and the prices are similar). I assume you will again suggest Hacker as the best option ? Can you also comment on the quality of the doors, currenlty were looking at gloss laminate doors, is it worth upgrading to doors higher up the range ?
Thanks
Rich – the higher up doors are more expensive materials and fabrication, not necessarily better in terms of quality. So the answer to “is it worth (it)” can only be answered by you…
Good luck,
kitchenguy
I am now not certain where you are getting your info, but great topic. I must spend some time learning much more or understanding more. Thanks for fantastic info I was on the lookout for this information for my mission.
Dear Kitchen guy,
I would like to know which company is better Cesar Poggen pohl? And why? we were considering Cesar kitchen for our project as poggen pohl is expensive. If we compare an apple to an apple kitchen from both the manufacturers then which one is better?
Waiting for your comments.
Dhaval – they are both good quality products. My decision would be based on the local dealer (reputation, length of time in business, design ability, etc.) and the network to support it (how many dealers of this company are in your country?).
Good luck!
kitchenguy
great web site – i’m so glad i found it!
Is Padini one of the best modern kitchens in terms of quality?
Thanks.
Jugal – thanks for the kind words. As I’m sure you’ve gathered already (from reading some of the posts) – I strongly think that Pedini is one of the best modern kitchens brands around these days and I think has the best ‘quality-to-price ratio’!
kitchenguy
We are the Pedini dealer in Atlanta, Georgia and we agree with you that Pedini has a great product. We became dealers because there was not one in town and after researching the different brands at EuroCucina many years ago for our home we became the dealer. The company is great to work with and we strive to provide the best service humanly possible.
Hello,
I need to choose a kitchen in Belgium, am totally lost and woud be grateful for advice(rel. small, 8sqm, one side: 2 high closets – 1 for oven + microwave, 1 for fridge, 1 slide out of 45-50 cm, sink, dishwasher, hanging storage above; other side: 45 slide-out, 80 hotplate with storage underneath 45 slideout, 110 low cupboard of approx. 36 cm high to be used as a “storage cum seat”). Have been to Ixina (sells Nobilia and a very restricted range of Leicht – quote of EUR 6300 + installation), Krefel (sells Alno, quote same as Leicht by Ixina), Scavolini (similar price for Liberamente in lacquer, 20% lower for Flirt with “stratifie” fronts). Will be going to Arrital (sold by Prolinea here). What would be the best in terms of value and durability? All prices are just for the furniture quoted (no appliances, no worktop), all models without handles (but need rather deep grooves for easy opening). Any other suggestions of brands to see?
Thanks a lot!!!!
Corner – these are all good value products. My advise is rather than focusing on the price (seem they are all in the same ball park), choose by the better dealership/designer. They are just as important as the product itself…
Good luck!
kitchenguy
Thanks. They’re all roughly the same price because that’s what my budget is (about max. 7000 for the furniture, so things like Bulthaup are not exactly in my league this time yet). I’m trying not to obsess about price but the fact is I haven’t seen anything I would fall in love with, so the only thing I can do is try get the “price vs. value” ratio more or less right. Is there any brand in this modest range that would positively stand out? It’s the first “real” kitchen I will have ever bought (the one we’ve got now was left here by the previous owners and is falling to pieces) and with 4 cats and 2 small kids I panic about getting something that will not survive long. I had half a mind to go “eco-friendly” and enquired about a integral wood kitchen from annex.de but never even got a quote from them, so “eco”‘s off. Given your personal Top 20, I might still try for a Haecker directly from Germany (what sort of mark-up should I expect over a Scavolini/Arrital as quoted above for the same type of finishes?).
Corner – if you can find a local Häcker dealer, you’re better off with their entry-level product, even if it is a bit more expensive. Not sure of the mark up difference as it varies from one country to the next and from one dealer to another.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Hi kitchen guy! Wanna get your opinion. How would you compare hacker and Leicht kitchen? In terms of branding, market shares, price and quality. Their design is very similar to my opinion. Cheers!
Christine – if you’re asking as a consumer, branding and market share really do mot matter much… Quality and price is more or less the same, with Häcker having a slight edge. If you are a reseller, looking for a product, it varies from one market to another and really depends where you are located.
kitchenguy
Hi there,
I wonder if you could help with a question about Hacker? We were getting quotes for a systemat kitchen when one dealer quoted us classic by mistake. It was obviously considerably cheaper. About 30%. This dealer claims they the classic is made of exactly the same materials but just has a different colour inside and slightly different sizes. This seesm unlikely to me. Do you have any info?
Man thanks.
Duncan – most brands today offer a ‘value line’ – it is usually made the same as the rest of the products, but offers less options. The company can offer a discount for various reasons, but mostly because they can mass produce and stock the components (therefore less options) and streamline production this way.
If you like the colors and options – go for it!
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Hi Can you please give me your opinion about the fittings of Blums especially the servo drive.
Thank you so much.
Lydia – all the leading hardware brands, such as Blum, Grass, Hettich, Salice, etc. are great products. The different between them is just the design and slight difference in the movement, as they often times patent their new designs. The ‘no names’ (see under EUROPEAN HARDWARE COMPANIES on the right side-bar) are also good, but offer less options and more standard choices.
kitchenguy
Hi Kitchen Guy,
The missus and I are living in Germany and we’re trying to make a decision between Leicht, Hacker and Schuller. Could you give a ranking just based on quality between these 3 brands? Also, Schuller has the “next 125” range in its lineup which is a price category up on its normal range. Is there a quality difference between the standard range and the “next 125”? Don’t they just use the same working parts but paint it a different colour (metaphorically speaking) at the end?
Many thanks for any insight given.
Great site by the way.
Adrian – my ranking is: Häcker, Schüller Leicht – in that order. I think there are a few other differences, not just the door color, but you’re better off asking the dealer to point them out to you.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Thanks kitchen guy. Was out of WiFi range for a couple of weeks and couldn’t reply.
We’re probably going to go with Häcker even though the dealer selling Schüller is offering us higher-end kitchen appliances from Siemens in his bundle. Your recommendation sealed the deal for us!
Just so I understood correctly, you meant that of the three, Hacker, Schüller and Leicht, Häcker ranks first on quality, right?
Adrian – that’s right.
Also, ask the Häcker dealer about their deal with Miele appliances. They featured a really great concept at Eurocucina, in April – Miele wall ovens, matching the cabinet color…
Good luck!
kitchenguy
Back again. Have now seen Hacker SystematART and fallen in love (4030 High Gloss “polarweiss” with the slightly rounded edges). Apparently I can get it for a decent price in the neighbouring Germany. Thanks for the advice! Any idea about a matching worktop (current plan is to combine it with Zimbabwe Black in matte finish, 3cm, the floor is currently massive oak – large boards oiled cotton white).Thanks again.Corner
Corner – glad to hear back from you and happy to hear you’re in love… 🙂
All sounds great and regarding the top – if you can, wait till the cabinets are in and bring samples home to look at them. It is much easier to decide this way.
Good luck!
kitchenguy
Can you suggest which make is better – haecker or Aran
I am trying to finalise between the two brands
Srini – there’s no competition… – Häcker.
kitchenguy
Thank you so much for your honest, straightforward comments! I live in the U.S. and would like your input on Pedini vs. Poggenpohl as far as what can be gained from the higher price point of Poggenpohl? Is it just the “name” you’re paying for, similar to “designer name brands” for apparel, etc… or do you get a significantly better product? If so, how? Also, I presume Scavolini, & Porcelanosa don’t come close in quality, is that correct? If you wouldn’t mind how about a quick yes or no in comparison to Pedini & Poggenpohl (as far as price/quality) for the following:
Neff, Poliform, Ernestomeda, Bentwood, Snaidero, Siematic & Balthaup? I GREATLY APPRECIATE YOUR TIME! THANK YOU VERY MUCH & HAVE A GREAT DAY!
Sue – ‘apples to apples’, Pedini is a better product – they offer more and shouldn’t actually be cheaper… It is either that you are not comparing equal finishes or that the local dealers are not marking up the product equally. Examples: Pedini offers a dust seal (rubber gasket) on all openings, Poggenpohl doesn’t. Pedini offers many 1″ doors and even thicker, Poggenpohl doesn’t, etc.
Scavolini, Porcelanosa and Ernestomeda are not up to par with the above two.
Poliform, Snaidero, SieMatic and Bulthaup are.
Neff and Bentwood are completely different animals.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Thank you…much appreciated! Could you please give a ranking based on quality only between Pedini, Poliform, Snaidero, SieMatic and Bulthaup?
Also…Neff and Bentwood’s modern cabinets don’t compare in quality, correct?
Thanks! Your website is the best…so glad I came across it!
Sue – Thanks for all the kind words, glad I can help.
Pedini, Poliform, Snaidero, SieMatic and Bulthaup are all top notch modern products. Chose based on the design, designer and service.
Neff is not a European product – it is Canadian and besides the point that it is a little behind on technology and innovation, it is a bit clunky looking, very overpriced and from what I hear, very poor service…
Bentwood is an American product – not sure about the service level, as there is very little of it out there and I have no data in that area, it is also a bit behind on technology and innovation, a bit clunky looking and very overpriced in comparison to the European brands.
It is hard to beat the Europeans in their own game… Just like they always have an extremely hard time competing with American brands on traditional designs.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Hi kitchen guy,
I am trying to identify kitchen cabinet suppliers from europe who are price oriented yet having good quality standards. I am supplying kitchen cabinets in india for projects where numbers go into 500 units and over. Brand like hacker schuller get out of the league for this so if you have any suggestions for which suppliers can be targeted.
Ash – this is too big of a question with many possible answers and I’m missing a lot of info from you to do a good job at it.
Please contact me directly.
Thanks,
kitchenguy
Very impressed by your blog.
Trying to find our first kitchen in Munich and read that you list Eggersman, Häcker, Siematic and Zeyko in your top 20. I understand that Siematic is in the Mercedes class and Häcker probably in a VW middle class. Could you tell me where Eggersman and Zeyko feature both in terms of price and quality? We’ve looked at a Schüller kitchen but would like something to last for a good twenty years and not entirely convinced it will stand the test of time. Looking for something a couple of notches up and would be grateful for suggestions for companies doing decent white, handle-less kitchens.
Kitchenqueen – all 4 brands are in the Mercedes/BMW/Audi category, they are just different from one another. Eggersman is a smaller, more custom product, geared towards unique wood veneers, concrete finishes, etc. SieMatic, is more into innovation and new designs, but are less custom. Häcker are as high quality as the others, but will almost no flexibility, at a lower price point and Zeyko is between SieMatic and Häcker. All of them are doing the look you’re interested in and so the choice should be based on price and service.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Many thanks for your help, Kitcheyguy.
One futher question: could you recommend any German manufacturers between the Alnos/Schüllers and Häcker/Siematic classes doing the white, handleless look?
Kitchenqueen – every single European manufacturer today offers this exact style – it is the ‘bread and butter’ of the kitchen design today…
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Hello Kitchenguy,
Considering Allmilmo kitchen in wave lacquer finish. Please respond if i am making a right choice quality and durability wise. Also poggenpohl and Siematic is in the same price category. Please rank the top german brands based on quality. Thank you.
Slavap – Allmilmo’s quality and durability is fine. I found them to be a bit stagnant (design wise) and over priced. SieMatic is kind of ‘in the same boat’, but Poggenpohl should be cheaper…
To see Top German Brands, see My Personal Top 20.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Kitchen guy
Am a dealer of nobilia seeking a premium brand. Am in between SIEMATIC, pedini, bulthup. There is a local poggen pohl, scavolini and alno dealers . My zone is price sensitive even at the premium brands.
What European brand would you recommend ?
Paul – with these competitors, I think Pedini will be your best bet – they are priced more aggressively and have more options.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Kitchen guy
We are a small company based in east Africa with 1 Cnc machine and other basic panel processing machines.
We are interested in services of a designer who will create likes of lb3 in SIEMATIC and similar designs as offered by other leading European brands. Our market is very price driven.
Can you recommend any designers.?
Munyiri,
If I understand you correctly, you’re looking to hire a designer, to design a line for you… – please confirm.
kitchenguy
Yes , we are looking for a line designer
Munyiri – there are numerous architects in Italy, that would love to do this job. Simply look at all the kitchen brands, listed on this site, see their name (as the designers of the model) and contact them directly.
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Hi kitchen guy, I hope all is well. The last time I wrote to you we were going through a list of brands we were interested in. We have since spent 2 days with bulthaup detailing what we would like to do. However the price they have quoted us was simply too much – over $100k for what is actually just two runs against the walls.
I know you talk highly of pedini which we will look at tomorrow. But what do you think of valcucine and how expensive is it. We live in London and love the look of their logica system, which we will also see for the first time this week. We of course do not want to waste time, so if it will cost $100k that is about 30% too much. We would be grateful for your opinion. Thanks.
Barry – Valcucine should price about the same as Bulthaup. The advantage with Pedini is that they havea lower entry level products, that will allow you to get the look, without the huge expense. Obviously, if you use Pedini’s highest end finishes (glossy lacquer exotic woods, all glass cabinets, etc.) you’ll find yourself at the same price point as the other guys.
Good luck and let me know what you ended up doing,
kitchenguy
Thank you for the response kitchen guy. We discovered exactly that today with the logica system which for the main run was priced at sixty thousand pounds to us. We will look at Pedini tomorrow and Poggenpohl have suggested they can quote us something closer to 50k for everything. Really the world of kitchens is crazy 🙂
Thank you for your help again and we will keep you updated with our experience.
Kind regards,
Barry
Hi kitchenguy
Our kitchen planner (DT Kitchens, Clapham Junction – seem very good) have designed a Hacker kitchen for us with systemat. We’ve asked how they can drop the price and they have suggested changing the carcase units to Hacker classic. This should save us around £3k. I’m curious how different these really are and I’m hoping you have a view?
Many thanks, in advance
Jon
Jon,
Hacker offers two different product lines – The (commercial) classic line, is a good quality product with standard equipment and a wide range of (commercial) fronts.
The Systemat line offers additional quality features like optional dust seal, optional glass sides on the pull-outs, thicker shelves, more storage space together with a range of high-quality fronts like veneer, glass, etc.
So, if you are looking at one of the fronts which Hacker offers in both lines, you will save a good amount of money by switching from systemat to classic.
But, If you yfearing the features (or fronts) that do not exist in their classic line, you will have to stay with the Hacker systemat product.
Good luck and please keep us posted!
Kitchenguy
Hi Kitchenguy,
What a great site! You may be the answer to my prayers as I have become very confused.
I’m in state of Georgia and have priced Poggenpohl and Poliform Varenna.
Pedini will be working up a design and prices for me next week. With similar designs and products chosen, PP is $20,000 more than Varenna. Does this make sense? Are they that much better?
Will Pedini come out more expensive than the other two? Between the 3 who has the best quality for price. Thank you for you time and expertise!
Charlotte
Hi Charlotte – glad you’re here! 🙂
Poggenpohl, Varenna and Pedini should all be at approx the same price. It is the door style, the design and the mark-up the local showroom is adding, that will determine the final price.
If all is equal (same door finish, design layout, etc.), Pedini is the better product of the three – it is built better (see the dust seal, the steel legs, the thickness of the materials, etc.), it is more flexible (custom colors, sizes, etc) and from what I understand they offer a better service (accuracy in deliveries, standing behind the product, etc.).
Good luck and please keep me posted,
kitchenguy
Hi Charlotte,
I am one of the owners of the Pedini showroom. We look forward to providing a quote and design for your kitchen. Please give us a call and we can make arrangements to meet and review your needs. I am sure we can exceed your expectations. 404-817-3313
We look forward to hearing from you.
Lee
Thank you so much Kitchen Guy!
Thank you so much Kitchen Guy! On my way to Pedini today.
Kitchen Guy:
Your blog post is fascinating! I’ve been a representative of Poliform Varenna products for 10 years. Each year I find myself crawling through factories and showrooms (in Europe and the US) to ensure that I know the materials, practices, and benefits associated with all major brands. Please tell me the criteria you use when you compare Poliform Varenna, Poggenpohl, and Pedini. I know exactly how the manufacturers rate themselves against each other and how the European consumer rates these brands. I’m curious to learn more from you. I’m currently working to help unravel the “knot” of conflicting information for Charlotte and want to ensure she is getting accurate information as she seeks to buy a new kitchen. Thanks for your assistance!
Cheers,
Doug Henderson
Owner
Switch Modern – Atlanta
Hi Doug – Just like I said in the original post, these are the criteria I used to compare them (and I quote): “Poggenpohl, Varenna and Pedini should all be at approx the same price. It is the door style, the design and the mark-up the local showroom is adding, that will determine the final price.
If all is equal (same door finish, design layout, etc.), Pedini is the better product of the three – it is built better (see the dust seal, the steel legs, the thickness of the materials, etc.), it is more flexible (custom colors, sizes, etc) and from what I understand they offer a better service (accuracy in deliveries, standing behind the product, etc.).”
What else would a consumer need (or care about)? Does it really matter (or non bias…) how the manufactures rate themselves…? Please allow me to clue you in – they ALL think THEY are the best… 🙂
Since you say you know “…know exactly how the European consumer rates these brands.” – please share with us.
Thanks,
kitchenguy
Hi, Kitchen Guy
I am in the dreaming phase for a kitchen remodel for a small condo unit in Denver, Colorado. I love the sleek and minimalist of Pedini. For a modest size kitchen (10 to 12 ft of counter/cabinet space plus cabinetry to house integrated refrigerator, wall oven, cooktop, and dishwasher drawer),what would be the minimum dollar amount to budget for the cabinetry and countertops?
What other brands available in Denver with similar style to Pedini should we consider? I know there are a lot of variables to cost, but I am just trying to get an idea if i could do something for $50k or if I am way off base. Thank you!
Pekka – it is impossible to even guess prices, without have A LOT more information, but from what you’ve told me, I think the budget is doable (cabinets, counters & installation).
There are many European brands available in Denver Bulthaup, Poggenpohl and others).
Good luck!
kitchenguy
Thank you. Just wanted to make sure I had a good starting point for a budget.
I would like to know the which is batter option between grass and hettich?
Bharat – they are both great brands and it is impossible to say that one is better than the other.
kitchenguy
Hi
I am trying to find a good German kitchen (supply and fit) company in the South East London, areas. Probably Schuller but I also like the look of Bauformat, can you recommend any companies??
Thanks
Brad – too many brands and I’m not 100% sure where each and one of them have a dealer…
Sorry,
kitchenguy
Hi.
Very helpfull blog! We are absolut to Renée our kitschen completely and we have looked at Schmidt and Siematic. We live in London. What is your thoughts on that and also what would you say on handle less design ? Any tips would be nice.thanks
Cc – both are good brands. SieMatic is a bit on the higher end and Schmidt should be a slightly better value. ‘Handle less’ is very ‘in’ now a days, but is also a safe look, as it is an all-time classic.
The best tip is – don’t just focus on the brand and the price. make sure the dealer/designer is the right one as well!
Good luck,
kitchenguy
Hi,
We’re looking at a SieMatic kitchen and by chance we passed at store selling Alno. We were curious, went in and got a presentation. The seller told us that Alno was quality wise the same as SieMatic, but cheaper due to a smaller organisation here in Sweden, where we live.
We don’t know anything about the quality of Alno – they only have one store in Sweden and that is in our town, but if you were to rank these two manufacturers against each other is what he states correct?
Poul
Poul – it’s like saying that VW is the same quality as MBZ, but that the price is cheaper, because there’s only one dealership in the country…
Please tell the guy to come up with a better story… SieMatic is more expensive than Alno, everywhere in the world and that is not the reason 🙂
kitchenguy